[MUD-Dev] Re: Issues from the digests and Wout's list

Miroslav Silovic silovic at srce.hr
Thu May 22 23:07:04 New Zealand Standard Time 1997


> In <199705210941.LAA00172 at regoc.srce.hr>, on 05/21/97 
>    at 08:27 AM, silovic at srce.hr (Miroslav Silovic) said:
> 
> >> In <199705190115.DAA06158 at regoc.srce.hr>, on 05/18/97 
> >>    at 06:19 PM, silovic at srce.hr (Miroslav Silovic) said:
> 
> >> Tho I haven't cleaned up the details, the presentation I have in mind
> >> is very much that the shared reality experienced in the MUD is a
> >> physical construct resulting purely from the mutual mental actions of
> >> the players.  Probably this will be presented in much the manner of
> >> (all) the players being once near-omnipitent (demi-)gods who were
> >> mutually responsible for the initial creation of the universe, but are
> >> now much descended from their former stature and power and
> >> concomittantly bereft of much of their memory.
> >> 
> >> See!  User-programming is perfectly in character.
> 
> >I don't see it: If I were god, I'd change the world by something that
> >starts with 'let there be *', not by something that starts with
> >@create blah. :)
> 
> I don't see this.  Were I a god, I would expect to be bound by
> strictures that don't apply to me as a mortal.  Consider the handling
> of side effects:
> 
>   Uhh, let there be light!
> 
>   Okay, we have uniform non-directional source-less light.  The 
>     world just *glows*.

> <vaguelly amusing variations deleted>
 
> It becomes rather similar to the recent ambiguity debates.  I see this
> as a variant upon programming with programming merely being a semantic
> form which allows precise and formalised description of a desired
> behaviour (as well as the debugging as above).

You misunderstood me completely. It should go something like this:

> tell bigshot_admin I want to create light
Bigshot admin tells you "Okay. You can. Now code it."
> codecodecode
> tell bigshot_admin Done.
Bigshot admin tells you Jussec...
Bigshot admin tells you Okay, looks like light to me.

Read also my other response in the same thread.

<snip>

> >I can tell
> >you that the experince is very hard to describe to somebody who never
> >played a high-impact scene. With practice, you learn to build a
> >'sub-persona' in your mind, and shift gears to it while playing him
> >or her (this is what I do and what most RPers I know do). Splitting
> >one's mind and then watching over your character's shoulder is the
> >most important source of fun for both RPers and actors. But in your
> >view of MUDding, this never happens.
> 
> Yup.  It is something I can appreciate, doubt I would enjoy, and am
> uncertain if I wish to enourage or explicitly support in my games (has
> little relevance to my interests or sense of importances).  Jaime's
> recent post discussing having the game presenting a possible choice to
> the player (do you succeed or fail at climbing the cliff) illuminates
> this well.  Such a question or decision requested by a game system is
> inherently antithetical to my concept of how a desirable game system
> works to an extent that I doubt they can be reconciled.

Well, I have to agree that we disagree here. I enjoy both types of
the game. However, I judiciously apply the term RP only on the game
that evoke the feeling above. 

	Miro




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