[MUD-Dev] TECH: programming languages (was: Re: TECH: STL / Heaps, etc.)

Bruce Mitchener bruce at puremagic.com
Thu Aug 16 07:44:59 New Zealand Standard Time 2001

Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:
> Bruce Mitchener wrote:
>>  * Has anyone used Prolog or a logic language in their mud?
> Richard Bartle obviously?

Happen to know of any further information on this?  How was it used?

>>  * How about XSLT? (Anyone doing wireless and using this to
>>  translate for the various systems?)
> You are probably better off buying somebody's product :-(.

For XSLT or for wireless? I only mentioned wireless as I knew of
some people using XSLT for such a thing.  I personally have little
interest in wireless.

There are plenty of good XSLT libs available though under various licenses.

>> Or is it that most from-scratch muds by hobbyists are done with
>> the intent to learn C/C++/Java more than doing research into what
>> might make for a more effective new type of server?

> Not really sure how a different imperative implementation language
> is going to get you to a new type of server?

Languages impose constraints upon the space of what is easily
achievable and their assumptions shape the design of a system.
While many of the differences will be within the implementation,
that doesn't render them irrelevant.

Taking a simple example, if you're working with a language or
embedding a language which can be sandboxed, or otherwise secured to
allow user-programming in a way similar to MOO or Cold, you're going
to end up with an end result that would be significantly different
from one that didn't have the capability of offering

The implementation level differences are obviously significant as
well. Taking one project that I've seen, with a language that
supports garbage collection and method forwarding, Miro's managed to
create a really cool object persistence system that has large parts
that are entirely transparent to the server programmer.  That's led
to a number of very different ways of looking at problems elsewhere
in the server and alternative ways of solving other problems because
the persistence system is a great enabling technology.

Another fun example would be E.  With full capability-based security
at one's fingertips, some pretty cool features could be given to the

Similarly, I know that my mindset changes depending on what language
I'm working in.  I write different sorts of code if I'm writing in
ColdC, or C, or C++, or Objective C, or TOM, or PostScript, or ....
That changed mindset leads to different ways of solving problems,
some of which are sometimes visible to the end-user, others which
merely greatly change the internal implementation.

So, maybe I've misunderstood your comment.

  - Bruce

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